The Rose Garden and White House happenings: Listening to voters’ concerns
Republican hypocrisy:
In fact, 20 red states have sued the federal government, arguing that Obamacare, including its preexisting-condition protections, is unconstitutional. Administrations are supposed to defend laws passed by Congress, but on these provisions, the Trump administration has refused.
And yet, Trump continues to argue that “Republicans will totally protect people with Pre-Existing Conditions, Democrats will not!”
When Trump made this claim at a rally in Wisconsin, he was echoed by Gov. Scott Walker (R), who urged the crowd: “Don’t believe the lies. We will cover people with preexisting conditions.”
This despite the fact that Walker authorized his own attorney general to join that 20-state lawsuit. But Walker is far from alone. Across the country, Republican politicians shamelessly conceal their track record on this issue.
LOST said:
lord_pabulum said:All the Democrats support DACA. Otherwise I thought their plan was the same one proposed by President Bush and supported by the Dems and killed by the Right-Wing.
We've read an inchoate plan from mtierney. The Republican plan is to enforce existing laws plus rescind DACA (but leave DREAM) and build a wall. Is there a Democratic plan besides the symbolic policies of the various "sanctuary cities"?
Here is the position of a former refugee running as the Democratic Candidate for Congress next door.
https://malinowskifornj.com/immigration/
Not to mention the fact that the argument that "the Republican plan is to enforce existing laws plus rescind DACA (but leave DREAM)" is missing the fact that DREAM wasn't put into law. There's nothing to "leave".
See, now I am holding my breath again because I think you missed my response. Given the importance that you have attached to this issue in your previous posts, I will repost and then await your reply.....
mtierney said:
exhale, please!
I do not like the President’s twittering his statements daily. However, he has seen how the news is shredded with multiple interpretations . So, he thinks his tweets get his message out.
There are still ways to misinterpret tweets, so, I think there is danger there.
What HRC did was clandestine. Our President is using the internet to speak out.
Big difference.
Thank you for your response.
As the others noted, the article was about Trump's use of his personal, unsecured iPhone to conduct the business of the Presidency.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/24/us/politics/trump-phone-security.html
Give it a read and let me know what you think in the context of the hoopla about HRC's email.
I would like to hear more suggestions concerning “my inchoate plan” re building reception centers - 2 or 3 — along our southern border with Mexico. There would be no wall along the border as is presently envisioned, the the centers would be secured. As we all know, The border serves as a means of entry from Central America.
Mexico will provide the land and build the centers with what I believe would be an outpouring of supporting funds from the USA, churches, philanthropy, charities, etc.
These centers would provide a stable environment, safety, family housing, outreach opportunities, schooling for children, job training, and health care. All migrants would be given a voice, processed and identified.
These would not be penal institutions in appearance or reality. Prefabricated and low cost housing could rise up quickly (I am not suggesting tents). Medical, processing, schools, and visitor centers which would serve as watchful eyes to insure the migrants are given proper care and attention. Playgrounds for the children and perhaps a communal kitchen to oversee the feeding of thousands of folks.
This approach is humane, dignified, and workable. Everyone would get on board. Bad apples would be filtered out and sent back to their country of origin.
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
gerritn said:
lord_pabulum said:Why do we need a plan for something that is not a problem to begin with?
Nice to
ml1 said:We've read an inchoate plan from mtierney. The Republican plan is to enforce existing laws plus rescind DACA (but leave DREAM) and build a wall. Is there a Democratic plan besides the symbolic policies of the various "sanctuary cities"?
lord_pabulum said:I don't know of anyone who wants open borders, despite what Trump is saying. So Obama's statement is pretty much the position of the vast majority of Americans. But of course he said those words in 2005, when the word "pour" was more descriptive of reality than it is now, after several years of dramatic increase in the number of undocumented immigrants in the U.S. In fact, there are estimated to be fewer undocumented immigrants in the U.S. today than there were just a few years ago.
mtierney said:
Perhaps, instead of building a wall, Mexico and other Central American countries should construct strategic “Ellis island” reception areas. The US could help with the finances. Our Immigration officials could interview and process folks, etc.
An actual idea or start a plan on how to deal with immigration fairly and responsibly. As Barack Obama said "We simply cannot allow people to pour into the United States undetected, undocumented, unchecked, and circumventing the line of people who are waiting patiently, diligently, and lawfully to become immigrants in this country."
I agree. Just enforce existing laws.
ETA - I like Canada and Australia's more sensible model though
mtierney said:
who would have thunk it!? From the Times, yet...
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/25/opinion/trump-health-care-infrastructure-midterms.html?rref=collection%2Fissuecollection%2Ftodays-new-york-times&action=click&contentCollection=todayspaper®ion=rank&module=package&version=highlights&contentPlacement=1&pgtype=collection
I want some of the drugs the NYT editorial board is taking.
mtierney said:
I would like to hear more suggestions concerning “my inchoate plan” re building reception centers - 2 or 3 — along our southern border with Mexico. There would be no wall along the border as is presently envisioned, the the centers would be secured. As we all know, The border serves as a means of entry from Central America.
Mexico will provide the land and build the centers with what I believe would be an outpouring of supporting funds from the USA, churches, philanthropy, charities, etc.
These centers would provide a stable environment, safety, family housing, outreach opportunities, schooling for children, job training, and health care. All migrants would be given a voice, processed and identified.
These would not be penal institutions in appearance or reality. Prefabricated and low cost housing could rise up quickly (I am not suggesting tents). Medical, processing, schools, and visitor centers which would serve as watchful eyes to insure the migrants are given proper care and attention. Playgrounds for the children and perhaps a communal kitchen to oversee the feeding of thousands of folks.
This approach is humane, dignified, and workable. Everyone would get on board. Bad apples would be filtered out and sent back to their country of origin.
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
why do your hypothetical centers need to be in Mexico, especially if the U.S. is funding them? Why can't they be in the U.S.?
Mexico has to play an important role here since it is the passage way to the border. Fully processed migrants will have the opportunity to enter the US afterward. A great many are leaving their home countries to find jobs here. Others are fleeing violence. I believe the processing centers in Texas were established with different goals and have not had great success — separating families, etc.
mtierney said:
I would like to hear more suggestions concerning “my inchoate plan” re building reception centers - 2 or 3 — along our southern border with Mexico. There would be no wall along the border as is presently envisioned, the the centers would be secured. As we all know, The border serves as a means of entry from Central America.
Mexico will provide the land and build the centers with what I believe would be an outpouring of supporting funds from the USA, churches, philanthropy, charities, etc.
These centers would provide a stable environment, safety, family housing, outreach opportunities, schooling for children, job training, and health care. All migrants would be given a voice, processed and identified.
These would not be penal institutions in appearance or reality. Prefabricated and low cost housing could rise up quickly (I am not suggesting tents). Medical, processing, schools, and visitor centers which would serve as watchful eyes to insure the migrants are given proper care and attention. Playgrounds for the children and perhaps a communal kitchen to oversee the feeding of thousands of folks.
This approach is humane, dignified, and workable. Everyone would get on board. Bad apples would be filtered out and sent back to their country of origin.
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
What you’ll land up with is a version of what we have designed (only supposedly without the barbed wire, I guess) for our offshore processing centres. These are conveniently managed by personnel companies that won the government tenders - oddly, the same companies known for running private prisons and private armies, because social enterprise can’t compete with secure staffing/$$ ratio demanded by governments for work of this. Plus, social enterprise doesn’t have to connections at high levels of power to ensure a successful large-scale project of this kind will work within 6 months, to keep government polling sweet.
The non-walled sections of border between your Centers will be ‘leaky’, providing temptations for other undocumented arrivals to continue attempt crossing. People inside your Centers will find the presence of quasi-Serco (prison guard) staff stifling, and will realise they’re in modern holding camps designed break their spirits.
The plan sounds well-meaning, but is doomed because it’s founded on the belief that ‘too many people are coming in at once, we can’t cope, it’s someone else’s problem’ but isn’t discussed with regards to causes and global solutions. (Global poverty, global unrest, global uncertainty etc)
FWIW, I don’t believe in offshore processing for here, and think we’ve totally stuffed up the asylum and refuge seeking process for decades. We’ve had better options for dealing with informal arrivals and visa overstayers, but have chosen to demonise a select group for political advantage. It’s ethically wrong, and against the Australian values (and laws) I raised with. It’s also lazy thinking.
Headline from mtierney's NYT link above:
"How a Democratic House Could Work With Trump
If he remembers his campaign promises. And cares enough to stick with them."
The whole key here is in the subtitle. Really???
At least we know where Shakespeare stood on immigrants (called strangers in his era)
I have now, officially, asphyxiated, waiting for a reply from mtierney. 
I freaked out yesterday when, returning home from a trip to Shop-Rite for storm supplies, I could not find my iPhone! After much frantic house cleaning, auto checking and purse and pocket searching, nada! I called my son, who lives 80 miles away, for help. He couldn’t find it either, but suggested I use the find my phone app. Brilliant boy! When the map appeared on my iPad, with a signal blinking over the location of my house, I was both shocked and embarrassed. Using the send sound button, I walked from room to room, and, very faintly, I heard a sound in a room I had thoroughly searched more than once! The little devil had worked itself underneath the wooden breakfast tray on my bed, muffled by the down comforter! 
Hmm, I have questions: how does the President manage several Iphones as he travels hither and yon? Would each phone have the same number? What if one of the devices fell into the wrong hands? The mind boggles!
mtierney said:
I freaked out yesterday when, returning home from a trip to Shop-Rite for storm supplies, I could not find my iPhone! After much frantic house cleaning, auto checking and purse and pocket searching, nada! I called my son, who lives 80 miles away, for help. He couldn’t find it either, but suggested I use the find my phone app. Brilliant boy! When the map appeared on my iPad, with a signal blinking over the location of my house, I was both shocked and embarrassed. Using the send sound button, I walked from room to room, and, very faintly, I heard a sound in a room I had thoroughly searched more than once! The little devil had worked itself underneath the wooden breakfast tray on my bed, muffled by the down comforter!
Hmm, I have questions: how does the President manage several Iphones as he travels hither and yon? Would each phone have the same number? What if one of the devices fell into the wrong hands? The mind boggles!
I'm sure the President just carries his one personal phone, the same as he managed to do before he was elected. He can let someone else worry about any official phones.
I doubt the multiple phones issue bothers him at all, just like it doesn't bother him that he uses an unsecured line for conversations.
I wonder if the "find my phone" could be hacked so that someone with bad intentions would be able to know the President's exact location at a hotel or country club, or on the golf course?
mtierney said:
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
The sky isn't falling at all. In fact there is no immigration problem, it's just made up to whip up the base and make them go vote every two years. So here is my proposal: DO NOTHING, just enforce existing laws & process. No extra spending, no extra complications, no nothing. How is that for a conservative plan?
gerritn said:
mtierney said:The sky isn't falling at all. In fact there is no immigration problem, it's just made up to whip up the base and make them go vote every two years. So here is my proposal: DO NOTHING, just enforce existing laws & process. No extra spending, no extra complications, no nothing. How is that for a conservative plan?
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
Many years ago gays and marriage equality was used to whip up their base. Before then blacks, such as welfare queens, Willie Horten, etc. Its no longer giving them the traction they need.
Hence, the latest bogeyman, the immigrants.
Who will they pick on next?
mtierney said:
Ok, now let’s hear other options other then name-calling and the sky is falling chorus.
Oh the irony....
mtierney said:
Hmm, I have questions: how does the President manage several Iphones as he travels hither and yon? Would each phone have the same number? What if one of the devices fell into the wrong hands? The mind boggles!
He travels with an entourage of assistants. Even when he goes to Shop-Rite.
joanne said:
mtierney said:
I would like to hear more suggestions concerning “my inchoate plan” re building reception centers - 2 or 3 — along our southern border with Mexico. There would be no wall along the border as is presently envisioned, the the centers would be secured.
The plan sounds well-meaning, but is doomed because it’s founded on the belief that ‘too many people are coming in at once, we can’t cope, it’s someone else’s problem’ but isn’t discussed with regards to causes and global solutions. (Global poverty, global unrest, global uncertainty etc)
+++
Trump is right, his side IS winning. Sadly.
gerritn said:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/27/us/active-shooter-pittsburgh-synagogue-shooting.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Trump is right, his side IS winning. Sadly.
We can thank Trump, whose rhetoric, has the crazies feeling empowered to come out of the woodwork.
The suspect posted this morning that “HIAS likes to bring invaders in that kill our people..I’m going in.” Will the winning ever stop?
dave23 said:
The suspect posted this morning that “HIAS likes to bring invaders in that kill our people..I’m going in.” Will the winning ever stop?
"Pittsburgh suspect Robert Bowers posted this AM “HIAS likes to bring invaders in that kill our people..I’m going in” archive.fo/1gI5n"
https://twitter.com/lrozen/status/1056221288887398401
"HIAS is Hebrew immigration aid society he seemed recently obsessed w/. “1488” at top of his social media page apparently anti semitic symbol"
https://twitter.com/lrozen/status/1056221722628841473
"HIAS and other Jewish groups had been promoting a nationwide “refugee shabbat” last weekend. bowers targeted shabbot service today"
https://twitter.com/lrozen/status/1056223976349941762
We (my wife and older son) lived not far from Tree of Life 50 years ago. My grandparents were from Squirrel Hill.
Something like this is just something that nobody could have imagined.
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All the Democrats support DACA. Otherwise I thought their plan was the same one proposed by President Bush and supported by the Dems and killed by the Right-Wing.
Here is the position of a former refugee running as the Democratic Candidate for Congress next door.
https://malinowskifornj.com/immigration/