Bernie, Bernie, Bernie!

tom said:
Boring. One absurdly extremist argument after another. "Why not $20,000 an hour," "Employers would never dream of slave labor only provide compensation if coerced."


You ask above, "How do you suppose we reverse the wealth transfer to the rich?" The answer is simple: the exact opposite of what we did to begin it. We slashed the top marginal rates, and now we need to steeply hike them again.
What else, after all, will stop the obscene accumulation of wealth that will eventually turn us into a plutocracy?

I'm not sure that's going to work. Is the plan to get the rich to spend a lot of $$ on tax avoidance. Wait, I be the guys they pay for that are rich too!

Look at the chart below. In these golden age of high taxes revenues as a % of GDP didn't measure up. And let's not forget this was a robust post war period. Superficially this sounds good. Again, the reason to do this is political and not economical.

Any other dials you guys want to turn on your economobile?

A man for all Seasons...............and all Reasons...............you have a choice

https://www.facebook.com/senatorsanders/photos/a.91485152907.84764.9124187907/10153789846027908/?type=1&theater

That's an interesting chart. Does it go past 2002? I'd like to see what happened after Bush cut the tax rate further, because a lot of people weren't happy when Obama wanted to raise the upper tax rates back to where they were between 93 and 02

TylerDurden said:

Anyhoo, I have no personal issues with you. Other than the fact that I'm basically showing you how things work and you keep implying I'm just some big old meany.
So, at the risk of being presumptuous I'm going to list some policies I feel are harmful to the poor and you tell me which ones you actually disagree with:

1. Compulsory education determined by Address: Education in this country is an absolute embarrassment. I don't have link handy, but I read 46% of the country believes the world is less than 10,000 years old. 46%!
2. Department of Education: See above. What a absolute train wreck of a policy
3. Federal Reserve System: Redistribute from the middle & poor and give to the rich & well connected. But don't worry. It's for your own good. Remember just a little inflation is good. So, prices must always go up! So, you wanna save. Here are some 0% interest rates! Good luck with that!
4. Welfare Laws: Incentives to not work. To not form traditional family units. Born into poverty? Stay in poverty!
5. Policies that make it more expensive/risky to hire: ACA/Minimum Wage/Social Security/Job Protections for Groups: Having trouble getting that first job? Never fear, the government is here to provide disincentives to hire you!
6. Drug Laws: Let's make felons out of individuals displaying behavior that is expected by the human animal. And remember non-violent criminal who never hurt anyone but yourselfe, when you're out click that felon box when you apply for a job!

That's off the top of my head.

I do not disagree with everything you say:

1. Public Education worked very well for over 100 years and helped to build America. If "The Battle of Waterloo was won on the playing fields of Eton" then wasn't WWII won in the school yard of P.S. 88? Then what happened is that woman began being able to enter professions other than education and nursing and the quality of school teachers diminished. As White people moved to the suburbs inner-city schools became populated more and more by minorities about whom the powers that be don't really care. This is not an exhaustive explanation but just a summary of my observations. The belief among many that the Earth is less than 10,000 years old is not the fault of the Pubic Schools. I don't think they teach that. It's the fault of "religious leaders" and their political allies on the Right who reject what the schools teach and cling to a literal reading of a book never meant to be literal.

2. I really don't know much about the Federal Dept. of Ed. but don't see how it's existence hurts the poor.

3. I'll pass. I admit to not understanding the Fed and monetary policy.

4. That was supposed to be changed by Clinton's Welfare Reform, but the true answer is that we ought to have full employment. IMHO that is impossible under Capitalism so we ought to as a society provide financial support for the unemployed.

5. Businesses will always hire the number of people they need. But jobs that pay little with no benefits do nothing to eliminate poverty, they perpetuate it. How many people in our society are poor despite having full-time jobs?

6. Agreed!

tylerdurden,

I didn't see this thread until now.

I've read in several places that most recipients of welfare use it for only a short period. Maybe it's hard to believe, but most people prefer to earn their ways through life and don't like relying on handouts. I understand the incentive to get a check for doing nothing, but it doesn't work as well as many seem to think.

I don't understand your comment on compulsory education based on address. What does that mean? I agree our schools ought to be better than they are, but are you calling for the dismantling of public education? I can't tell. Just because something is suboptimal doesn't mean eliminating it improves things.

I think there should be minimum standards of living. If you disagree, then yes, I think you are a big old meany. In general, living standards have increased over time. This is a good thing, and I would like to see the trend continue. Things such as a heated home with refrigeration and running water are examples of what we expect to see everywhere. Nowadays, a phone and an internet connection are becoming nearly as essential. As for difficulty finding jobs, maybe there could be a low minimum wage for starter jobs where the wage is guaranteed to go up after a certain amount of time.

I strongly agree with you on drug laws.

Department of Education: I don't know enough to have an opinion.

Federal Reserve: I don't know enough, but I believe I agree with you.