Biden vs Trump
From RCP...dementia or foot in mouth disease?
“He needed an easy target, and for his long-awaited return to HBO, the late Robin Williams settled on the incumbent vice president. “We still have great comedy out there,” Williams said on stage at Constitution Hall. “There’s always ramblin’ Joe Biden.”
“And the riff killed. The crowd just a couple blocks from the White House howled at the expense of the National No. 2, and Williams had no shortage of impressions and material to deliver:
“Biden says the craziest things -- Even people with Tourette's go, “No. No! What is going on?”
Biden might be crazy -- Joe is like your uncle who’s on a new drug and hasn’t got the dosage right. “I’m proud to work with Barack America.” He’s not a superhero, you idiot!
“Biden needs to be sedated -- Come here! “When FDR was on television...” There was no TV back then! Come here, Joe!
“The skit ended with Williams mock-Tasering an elderly and imaginary vice president to the ground. It was just a year into the Obama administration, and the title of the comedy special was “Weapons of Self-Destruction.”
“A decade later, and Biden continues to provide material. Even confined by coronavirus to the bowels of his Delaware home, Uncle Joe has been and remains comically inarticulate, inexplicably insensitive on race, and inadvertently funny. This time, however, his many gaffes have not led to any self-destruction. Far from it. The former vice president continues to thump the current president in the polls. The RealClearPolitics national average shows Biden ahead by 6.4 percentage points.
“Either gaffes just don’t ruin a candidate as they once did, or the electorate is willing to cut Biden slack after four years of Donald J. Trump’s presidency/reality TV show. Either way, there is a lot to overlook. The presumptive nominee of the Democratic Party has had a summer that surely has his primary opponents wondering how they ever lost to the guy.
“When time was running short during a May interview on “The Breakfast Club,” host Charlamagne tha God asked for one more question. “You've got more questions?" Biden told the African American interviewer. “Well, I tell you what: If you have a problem figuring out whether you're for me or Trump, then you ain't black.” He later apologized for the exchange by saying he “shouldn't have been such a wise guy.”
“But there was no apology after Biden mocked an African American journalist for supposedly doing drugs. Errol Barnett of CBS asked if the candidate had taken a cognitive abilities test, as Trump has. “Why the hell would I take a test? Come on, man,” Biden exploded. “That's like saying to you, before you got on this program, if you’d taken a test. Were you taking cocaine? ... What do you think, huh? Are you a junkie?" A spokesman later defended the rough rebuttal by saying it was “a preposterous question” and the response “showed the absurdity of it all.”
“While political junkies were still debating that exchange, Biden followed up the controversy with another. During an interview with members of the National Association of Black Journalists and National Association of Hispanic Journalists, Biden shared some demographic thoughts. Asked about returning to the negotiation table with the Cuban government, he said yes and then went off on a tangent.
“And by the way, what you all know, but most people don’t know, unlike the African American community, with notable exceptions, the Latino community is an incredibly diverse community with incredibly different attitudes about different things,” Biden explained.
“Uhh... did Joe Biden just say that Black people are all the same?” the Trump campaign tweeted, suggesting that the whole exchange was racist.
“If you look at the full video and transcript, it’s clear that Vice President Biden was referring to diversity of attitudes among Latinos from different Latin American countries. The video that is circulating is conveniently cut to make this about racial diversity, but that’s not the case,” Biden senior advisor Symone Sanders told RCP.
“That explanation, combined with past precedents, would indicate that Biden’s remarks won’t cause him much trouble. His record on race was already under scrutiny, particularly his opposition to mandatory school busing and his authorship of the 1994 Crime Bill, when the candidate compared white and minority children. “Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids,” he said last August in Iowa. And then after a pause, he clarified: “Wealthy kids, black kids, Asian kids — no, I really mean it. But think how we think about it.” A spokeswoman for the campaign told the New York Times that Biden had “misspoke and immediately corrected himself.”
“Correction came more swiftly when he claimed during the fifth Democratic primary debate that he was endorsed by the “only African American woman that’s ever been elected to the U.S. Senate.” The crowd groaned and Kamala Harris laughed. The African American senator from California threw her hands up in exasperation and shot back,“Nope. That’s not true. The other one is here.”
“Journalists wondered at the time whether the elder statesman had simply forgotten that Harris existed. Embarrassing but hardly fatal, the gaffe is long forgotten. Nine months later, the second African American woman elected to the Senate has, in fact, endorsed Biden. What’s more, she is a front-runner to be his running mate.
“Republicans have watched in wonder as the Democrat walks away again and again unscathed from so many mistakes. They dream of the moment when Biden finally places his foot in his mouth and can’t remove it. Their fantasy is it will come during the presidential debates. They might do well to remember the words of former Rep. Pat Schroeder. The Colorado Democrat famously said of Ronald Reagan that he had “perfected the Teflon-coated presidency: He sees to it that nothing sticks.”
“Reaganites would consider it sacrilege to compare Uncle Joe to the Gipper, but he’s not running against Ronald Reagan. He’s running against the un-Reagan. The former vice president keeps rambling, as Robins Williams would put it, and yet nothing sticks, perhaps because of who he’s facing in November. Columnist Paul Waldman recently argued in the Washington Post that the gaffe is dead, and “for that, we can thank Trump.”
“Yet, the Waldman theorem only explains Biden of the pandemic era, not Biden of the last three decades. His has been a career defined by explicit hot-mic moments (“This is a big f------ deal,” he told Obama before that president signed the Affordable Care Act), questionable rhetoric on race (“You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or Dunkin Donuts,” he once quipped, “unless you have a slight Indian accent. I’m not joking”), and occasional, unintentional hilarity (once, he bit his wife’s finger on stage in Iowa; another time he told students at Howard University that both he and Obama were recently tested for AIDS).
“But Biden has an uncanny habit of stepping in it and then stepping over controversy and into prominence. He launched his second failed bid for the presidency in 2007 and promptly sized up one of his competitors, then Illinois Sen. Barack Obama, as “the first mainstream African American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy.” He ended that cycle as Obama’s No. 2.
“Four years later, it was clear that time spent one beat away from the presidency did not temper his sensibilities. Stumping for a second term with Obama in 2012, he told a mostly African American audience that, if Mitt Romney won the White House, Republicans would “put y’all back in chains.”
“Such words have hardly slowed Biden’s rise. On the contrary, he owes his coming nomination to support from the African American community. He was losing, and losing badly, in the primary race when he ducked out of New Hampshire. He had watched Sen. Bernie Sanders take first in that state and then saw the Democratic socialist carry Nevada. A young, obscure mayor named Pete Buttigieg, who has never won the popular vote in a state-wide election, secured the most delegates in Iowa. By the time South Carolina rolled around, autopsies were already being prepped. The only thing left was to note the time of death.
“When the wheels of his plane rolled to a halt in South Carolina, Biden was not subtle. Forget the other early races, he told a crowd at the airport, “We haven’t heard from the most committed constituency of the Democratic Party.” He meant, he said, “the African American community, and the fastest growing segment of society, the Latino community.”
“Reading the stage directions may have made his advisers wince. But black voters loved it. Biden carried South Carolina and then went on to an impressive sweep on Super Tuesday. Soon he will accept the nomination and then go head-to-head with Trump. His strongest support comes from the African American community -- those voters who, conventional wisdom suggests, would be most offended each time he puts his foot in his mouth.
“If current polling holds, regardless of the inevitable gaffes ahead, Robin Williams might be right a second time: “There’s always ramblin’ Joe Biden.” The Democrat may soon “ramble” his way back into the White House. This time, as president.
Smedley said:
Dennis_Seelbach said:
Smedley said:
Yep, as I said in OP I think Biden is very close to peaking if he hasn't already. Sept and Oct will be a slog with downside risk for Biden. There's talk of a possible landslide based on some recent numbers, but I'd put my money on a close race.
Sure you would...so predictable.
I'm here to talk Biden v Trump. If you have any thoughts, insights or perspective to offer, I'm happy to read, consider and discuss. But if you're just here to do your usual MO of cranky, potshot put-downs, maybe step away from the computer and go get some fresh air mmmmkay?
First, who the F do you think you are telling me to go away?
Now that I have that off my chest, the second point is that you are NOT comparing Biden to Trump. You are debasing Biden, incorrectly IMHO, and promoting the orange menace. You have always been a closet Trump supporter. Now it's just becoming more obvious, as you let down the phony wall of impartiality.
ANY comparison of these 2, on ANY basis, favors Biden. Period ! Why don't you step away from the computer and go get some fresh air mmmmkay?
Funny how the trumpsters can hammer away at Biden, but can give Trump a pass on all the simmering crock pot of horse siht Trump has said and done in the last 4 years. Some pretend to be “independent” ...which is usually followed by “but”...
Just come out of the closet once and for all, like our dear neighbor on elm wood ave and fly the flags...
Jaytee said:
Funny how the trumpsters can hammer away at Biden, but can give Trump a pass on all the simmering crock pot of horse siht Trump has said and done in the last 4 years. Some pretend to be “independent” ...which is usually followed by “but”...
Just come out of the closet once and for all, like our dear neighbor on elm wood ave and fly the flags...
Whatever man (or woman)...I've shared a lot of views and opinions here over the past couple years, if anyone gets from that that I am a trumpster, you are entitled to that opinion.
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
mtierney said:
From RCP...dementia or foot in mouth disease?
“He needed an easy target, and for his long-awaited return to HBO, the late Robin Williams settled on the incumbent vice president. “We still have great comedy out there,” Williams said on stage at Constitution Hall. “There’s always ramblin’ Joe Biden.”
“And the riff killed. The crowd just a couple blocks from the White House howled at the expense of the National No. 2, and Williams had no shortage of impressions and material to deliver:
“Biden says the craziest things -- Even people with Tourette's go, “No. No! What is going on?”
Biden might be crazy -- Joe is like your uncle who’s on a new drug and hasn’t got the dosage right. “I’m proud to work with Barack America.” He’s not a superhero, you idiot!
“Biden needs to be sedated -- Come here! “When FDR was on television...” There was no TV back then! Come here, Joe!
“The skit ended with Williams mock-Tasering an elderly and imaginary vice president to the ground. It was just a year into the Obama administration, and the title of the comedy special was “Weapons of Self-Destruction.”
“A decade later, and Biden continues to provide material. Even confined by coronavirus to the bowels of his Delaware home, Uncle Joe has been and remains comically inarticulate, inexplicably insensitive on race, and inadvertently funny. This time, however, his many gaffes have not led to any self-destruction. Far from it. The former vice president continues to thump the current president in the polls. The RealClearPolitics national average shows Biden ahead by 6.4 percentage points.
“Either gaffes just don’t ruin a candidate as they once did, or the electorate is willing to cut Biden slack after four years of Donald J. Trump’s presidency/reality TV show. Either way, there is a lot to overlook. The presumptive nominee of the Democratic Party has had a summer that surely has his primary opponents wondering how they ever lost to the guy.
“When time was running short during a May interview on “The Breakfast Club,” host Charlamagne tha God asked for one more question. “You've got more questions?" Biden told the African American interviewer. “Well, I tell you what: If you have a problem figuring out whether you're for me or Trump, then you ain't black.” He later apologized for the exchange by saying he “shouldn't have been such a wise guy.”
“But there was no apology after Biden mocked an African American journalist for supposedly doing drugs. Errol Barnett of CBS asked if the candidate had taken a cognitive abilities test, as Trump has. “Why the hell would I take a test? Come on, man,” Biden exploded. “That's like saying to you, before you got on this program, if you’d taken a test. Were you taking cocaine? ... What do you think, huh? Are you a junkie?" A spokesman later defended the rough rebuttal by saying it was “a preposterous question” and the response “showed the absurdity of it all.”
“While political junkies were still debating that exchange, Biden followed up the controversy with another. During an interview with members of the National Association of Black Journalists and National Association of Hispanic Journalists, Biden shared some demographic thoughts. Asked about returning to the negotiation table with the Cuban government, he said yes and then went off on a tangent.
“And by the way, what you all know, but most people don’t know, unlike the African American community, with notable exceptions, the Latino community is an incredibly diverse community with incredibly different attitudes about different things,” Biden explained.
“Uhh... did Joe Biden just say that Black people are all the same?” the Trump campaign tweeted, suggesting that the whole exchange was racist.
“If you look at the full video and transcript, it’s clear that Vice President Biden was referring to diversity of attitudes among Latinos from different Latin American countries. The video that is circulating is conveniently cut to make this about racial diversity, but that’s not the case,” Biden senior advisor Symone Sanders told RCP.
“That explanation, combined with past precedents, would indicate that Biden’s remarks won’t cause him much trouble. His record on race was already under scrutiny, particularly his opposition to mandatory school busing and his authorship of the 1994 Crime Bill, when the candidate compared white and minority children. “Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids,” he said last August in Iowa. And then after a pause, he clarified: “Wealthy kids, black kids, Asian kids — no, I really mean it. But think how we think about it.” A spokeswoman for the campaign told the New York Times that Biden had “misspoke and immediately corrected himself.”
“Correction came more swiftly when he claimed during the fifth Democratic primary debate that he was endorsed by the “only African American woman that’s ever been elected to the U.S. Senate.” The crowd groaned and Kamala Harris laughed. The African American senator from California threw her hands up in exasperation and shot back,“Nope. That’s not true. The other one is here.”
“Journalists wondered at the time whether the elder statesman had simply forgotten that Harris existed. Embarrassing but hardly fatal, the gaffe is long forgotten. Nine months later, the second African American woman elected to the Senate has, in fact, endorsed Biden. What’s more, she is a front-runner to be his running mate.
“Republicans have watched in wonder as the Democrat walks away again and again unscathed from so many mistakes. They dream of the moment when Biden finally places his foot in his mouth and can’t remove it. Their fantasy is it will come during the presidential debates. They might do well to remember the words of former Rep. Pat Schroeder. The Colorado Democrat famously said of Ronald Reagan that he had “perfected the Teflon-coated presidency: He sees to it that nothing sticks.”
“Reaganites would consider it sacrilege to compare Uncle Joe to the Gipper, but he’s not running against Ronald Reagan. He’s running against the un-Reagan. The former vice president keeps rambling, as Robins Williams would put it, and yet nothing sticks, perhaps because of who he’s facing in November. Columnist Paul Waldman recently argued in the Washington Post that the gaffe is dead, and “for that, we can thank Trump.”
“Yet, the Waldman theorem only explains Biden of the pandemic era, not Biden of the last three decades. His has been a career defined by explicit hot-mic moments (“This is a big f------ deal,” he told Obama before that president signed the Affordable Care Act), questionable rhetoric on race (“You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or Dunkin Donuts,” he once quipped, “unless you have a slight Indian accent. I’m not joking”), and occasional, unintentional hilarity (once, he bit his wife’s finger on stage in Iowa; another time he told students at Howard University that both he and Obama were recently tested for AIDS).
“But Biden has an uncanny habit of stepping in it and then stepping over controversy and into prominence. He launched his second failed bid for the presidency in 2007 and promptly sized up one of his competitors, then Illinois Sen. Barack Obama, as “the first mainstream African American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy.” He ended that cycle as Obama’s No. 2.
“Four years later, it was clear that time spent one beat away from the presidency did not temper his sensibilities. Stumping for a second term with Obama in 2012, he told a mostly African American audience that, if Mitt Romney won the White House, Republicans would “put y’all back in chains.”
“Such words have hardly slowed Biden’s rise. On the contrary, he owes his coming nomination to support from the African American community. He was losing, and losing badly, in the primary race when he ducked out of New Hampshire. He had watched Sen. Bernie Sanders take first in that state and then saw the Democratic socialist carry Nevada. A young, obscure mayor named Pete Buttigieg, who has never won the popular vote in a state-wide election, secured the most delegates in Iowa. By the time South Carolina rolled around, autopsies were already being prepped. The only thing left was to note the time of death.
“When the wheels of his plane rolled to a halt in South Carolina, Biden was not subtle. Forget the other early races, he told a crowd at the airport, “We haven’t heard from the most committed constituency of the Democratic Party.” He meant, he said, “the African American community, and the fastest growing segment of society, the Latino community.”
“Reading the stage directions may have made his advisers wince. But black voters loved it. Biden carried South Carolina and then went on to an impressive sweep on Super Tuesday. Soon he will accept the nomination and then go head-to-head with Trump. His strongest support comes from the African American community -- those voters who, conventional wisdom suggests, would be most offended each time he puts his foot in his mouth.
“If current polling holds, regardless of the inevitable gaffes ahead, Robin Williams might be right a second time: “There’s always ramblin’ Joe Biden.” The Democrat may soon “ramble” his way back into the White House. This time, as president.
OMG, is this really all you have? Trump has more than this in one speech.
Smedley said:
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
Sounds like a comment better suited to the All Politics "Rose Garden", not this thread attempting a factual discussion of Biden v. Trump.
jamie said:
OMG, is this really all you have? Trump has more than this in one speech.
If a Democrat said Trump's "My opponent will hurt God and hurt the Bible", we'd still have to hear about it years or even decades later.
What is interesting is that an incumbent president - no matter how bad has usually had a 40% support level.
I would attribute this to a lot of the general public simply doesn't follow politics. This population is also probably more susceptible to the juvenile Trump tactics. He sensationalizes things like the world will fall into chaos if Joe is elected. 911 won't respond out for 5 days. Really dumb but effective stuff. Though it sounds like it won't be as effective as it was 4 years ago.
nohero said:
Smedley said:
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
Sounds like a comment better suited to the All Politics "Rose Garden", not this thread attempting a factual discussion of Biden v. Trump.
Fair point, especially as I was the one who started this thread and framed it as about the content and not the Rose garden mudslinging.
I try to be neutral to haters, ignore no-value potshot comments and stay on topic. But sometimes it's hard to resist the temptation to not sling a little mud back.
Smedley said:
Whatever man (or woman)...I've shared a lot of views and opinions here over the past couple years, if anyone gets from that that I am a trumpster, you are entitled to that opinion.
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
a lot of your opinions sound like the kind of thing only a Trump supporter would say. For instance the notion that Trump displays superior mental fitness to Biden. That's just a strange thing for anyone to say who isn't blind to Trump's obvious mental and psychological shortcomings. And there have been other instances of giving Trump praise that was completely unwarranted. So maybe some people think you're a Trumpster. But it's just as likely you're being contrarian to provide a foil to the "leftists." Problem is, anyone playing devil's advocate by trying to portray Trump as able to be anything other than the malignant incompetent narcissist he is, can come off looking like a GOP kool-aid drinker. Because objectively, there are no redeeming qualities to Donald J. Trump.
Smedley said:
Whatever man (or woman)...I've shared a lot of views and opinions here over the past couple years, if anyone gets from that that I am a trumpster, you are entitled to that opinion.
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
Extremes are not good arguments. If you can still find any redeeming qualities in Trump, then what else can you expect in a response? Is there a difference between being a racist and thinking a racist could be a good person? I’m not saying you should attack Trump. I’m watching your constant criticism of Biden. Just like the MT one. You’re just not as objective as you think you’re portraying yourself here. Your words are a true insight into your thoughts.
If someone as explicitly to the right of the median MOL poster as Smedley is voting Biden, I take that as an additional good data point favoring him this fall. Smedley finds Biden uninspiring and possibly a bit slow, but is voting for him anyway -- great! It's total number of votes, not total level of enthusiasm, that counts.
Jaytee said:
Extremes are not good arguments. If you can still find any redeeming qualities in Trump, then what else can you expect in a response? Is there a difference between being a racist and thinking a racist could be a good person? I’m not saying you should attack Trump. I’m watching your constant criticism of Biden. Just like the MT one. You’re just not as objective as you think you’re portraying yourself here. Your words are a true insight into your thoughts.
What’s an example of Smedley’s extreme arguments, or a redeeming quality that he or she found in Trump? I haven’t noticed any, but then again I haven’t been reading Smedley’s mind.
ml1 said:
But it's just as likely you're being contrarian to provide a foil to the "leftists." Problem is, anyone playing devil's advocate by trying to portray Trump as able to be anything other than the malignant incompetent narcissist he is, can come off looking like a GOP kool-aid drinker. Because objectively, there are no redeeming qualities to Donald J. Trump.
I think it’s even more likely that Smedley doesn’t like Trump but has some opinions about what he or she sees as Biden’s deficiencies and raised them for discussion without realizing that doing so was an affront to objective reality.
mtierney said:
ridski said:
Definitely looks like a guy who would sign a health care plan when he says he would. I think he would even ask lawmakers to write it, and when it’s done call it a big ******* deal.
Personally, I’m still waiting for the massive middle class tax cut Trump promised after the 2018 midterms, the Mexican Wall money, the original beautiful health care plan that covers everyone and would be cheaper than the ACA, infrastructure week, and a general sense of so much winning that I’ll be sick of winning. But the President is incompetent, an agent of chaos, and doesn’t give a **** about this country, so...
Don’t forget the COVID-19 global pandemic, which arrived on the heels of the fake impeachment debacle — and the prior three years+ of 2016 election results denial.
2 years of full control of all three tiers of government, 2 more years of control over the Senate and SCOTUS and he got nothing done because he's a useless fat grifter coasting along on our tax dollars and campaign finance fraud.
But let's talk about Trump's "distractions" which I guess really hampers his ability to do the job we pay him for. Two September 11's worth of people die every week from COVID-19 in the US, President Trump has sent out 17 tweets this morning and not one of them addresses it. He's more focused on banning TikTok than COVID-19.
The impeachment was very real. He was impeached, just like Clinton was. It went on for a week. He wasn't distracted, he's just a lazy scam artist.
DaveSchmidt said:
I think it’s even more likely that Smedley doesn’t like Trump but has some opinions about what he or she sees as Biden’s deficiencies and raised them for discussion without realizing that doing so was an affront to objective reality.
if this discussion was started without any reference to Trump, expressing concern about Biden, there would have been a lot of agreement. Hell, I'm concerned about him debating for sure. During the Democratic debates, his performances were lackluster at best. It seemed like all he was doing was shouting until his time was up. And I won't stop being concerned until such time as Biden wins the election.
But it's the preposterous notion that Trump seems more cognitively sound than Biden that had everyone flabberrgasted.
ml1 said:
Smedley said:
Whatever man (or woman)...I've shared a lot of views and opinions here over the past couple years, if anyone gets from that that I am a trumpster, you are entitled to that opinion.
I'm not surprised though, after all this is MOL, where anything to the right of Che Guevara is Trumpster territory...
a lot of your opinions sound like the kind of thing only a Trump supporter would say. For instance the notion that Trump displays superior mental fitness to Biden. That's just a strange thing for anyone to say who isn't blind to Trump's obvious mental and psychological shortcomings. And there have been other instances of giving Trump praise that was completely unwarranted. So maybe some people think you're a Trumpster. But it's just as likely you're being contrarian to provide a foil to the "leftists." Problem is, anyone playing devil's advocate by trying to portray Trump as able to be anything other than the malignant incompetent narcissist he is, can come off looking like a GOP kool-aid drinker. Because objectively, there are no redeeming qualities to Donald J. Trump.
Maybe we're using different definitions here. Or maybe you're misrepresenting my words, which I find you do fairly regularly.
I never said "Trump displays superior mental fitness to Biden". To me, mental fitness is a broad umbrella term pulling in a bunch of stuff from one's psyche -- emotional IQ, social health, empathy, etc. "Having a positive sense of how we feel, think and act." is one definition I see. So WRT mental fitness, Joe wins by a mile. Joe is a decent guy, Trump is a loathsome individual and a malignant narcissist. No contest.
What I DID say was "purely on the basis of articulation and mental acuity, Trump beats Biden IMO." I was referring specifically, and narrowly, to the issue of cognitive decline. Mental *sharpness*, not mental *fitness*. I believe both Trump and Biden are experiencing cognitive decline, and I believe Biden's decline is further along. Totally independent of /separate from what their character is, what's in their heart, who puts kids in cages and who doesn't, who disrespects John McCain and John Lewis and who doesn't, etc -- I think Biden shows more advanced cognitive decline than Trump does. And it might be a problem this fall.
That is my observation based purely on what I have personally observed. Yes I am aware that Biden's cognition is a right-wing talking point. But, just because something is a right-wing talking point doesn't automatically make it not true. Many right-wing talking points are BS, but unfortunately, I believe this one to be true.
Now that I've clarified what I actually said from the outset of this thread, if you still believe my observation that Biden's cognitive decline is further along than Trump's is "the kind of thing only a Trump supporter would say," then you are entitled to that opinion.
Smedley said:
What I DID say was "purely on the basis of articulation and mental acuity, Trump beats Biden IMO." I was referring specifically, and narrowly, to the issue of cognitive decline. Mental *sharpness*, not mental *fitness*. I believe both Trump and Biden are experiencing cognitive decline, and I believe Biden's decline is further along.
fair point. I'm not sure it's that much of a difference from my interpretation, but it's a distinction.
either way, it's still a preposterous notion. Why has Trump been prescribed the MoCA by a physician and Biden hasn't? Any comparison of Donald Trump's speech in 2020 to even ten years ago shows a dramatic and alarming decline. Transcripts of his extemporaneous speech are often gibberish.
the fact that you don't notice this is why some of us are concluding that you are biased toward Trump. Why I don't know, and it doesn't mean you're a Trump supporter. Maybe it's just a desire to appear "centrist" and "unbiased." But it's striking, and a little peculiar in my subjective opinion.
Here's the Trump argument against Biden:
Joe Biden is weak and would be DANGEROUS for America.
As usual, the liberal media refuses to tell the truth about Joe Biden and the corrupt policies he’d implement if he was President. Like always, THEY ARE LYING TO YOU!
We can’t let them get away with this. My team just launched new ads to FIGHT BACK against their biased coverage and EXPOSE the TRUTH about Sleepy Joe.
- Joe Biden has embraced the policies of the far-Left
- Joe Biden will RAISE your taxes
- Joe Biden will grant amnesty to 11 MILLION illegal immigrants
- And, Joe Biden will KILL American jobs
-------------------------------------------------------
Like more dangerous than 150,000+ dead from covid?
I have say - disputing Biden's cognitive abilities at this stage of the game is a HUGE win for Trump!
If every voter who believes Biden is a puppet of the far left who is experiencing cognitive decline votes for him anyway, and every voter who believes Biden is a neo-liberal corporate sell-out votes for him anyway, then I think we're headed toward landslide territory.
ml1 said:
Smedley said:
What I DID say was "purely on the basis of articulation and mental acuity, Trump beats Biden IMO." I was referring specifically, and narrowly, to the issue of cognitive decline. Mental *sharpness*, not mental *fitness*. I believe both Trump and Biden are experiencing cognitive decline, and I believe Biden's decline is further along.
fair point. I'm not sure it's that much of a difference from my interpretation, but it's a distinction.
either way, it's still a preposterous notion. Why has Trump been prescribed the MoCA by a physician and Biden hasn't? Any comparison of Donald Trump's speech in 2020 to even ten years ago shows a dramatic and alarming decline. Transcripts of his extemporaneous speech are often gibberish.
the fact that you don't notice this is why some of us are concluding that you are biased toward Trump. Why I don't know, and it doesn't mean you're a Trump supporter. Maybe it's just a desire to appear "centrist" and "unbiased." But it's striking, and a little peculiar in my subjective opinion.
Do you believe Biden in 2019/2020 debates, vs Biden vs Paul Ryan 2012, is not a dramatic and alarming decline?
mtierney said:
From RCP...dementia or foot in mouth disease?
I have to admit that I am a bit puzzled by the argument that he is recently showing early signs of dementia, but then use examples going back to 1984. If anything, that proves the opposite of what you are insinuating.
Smedley said:
Do you believe Biden in 2019/2020 debates, vs Biden vs Paul Ryan 2012, is not a dramatic and alarming decline?
No, but if I compare your 2017 posts with your current erratic posting history, I am worried
Smedley said:
Do you believe Biden in 2019/2020 debates, vs Biden vs Paul Ryan 2012, is not a dramatic and alarming decline?
Biden in 2020 would definitely have a difficult time in a debate with the Biden of 2012.
Smedley said:
Do you believe Biden in 2019/2020 debates, vs Biden vs Paul Ryan 2012, is not a dramatic and alarming decline?
no it's not alarming to me.
Certainly he's not as quick as when he was younger to find the words he wants to say, but who is? As I mentioned earlier, find me an unedited video of two or three minutes of Biden speaking and tell me it seems like a person with dementia. Aside from a fluffed word or two, what he says in its full context is perfectly reasonable.
otoh, Trump routinely rambles and repeats himself, jumping from clause to clause, often with no apparent logical connection. There is no comparison between his obvious impairment and Biden. It may not be the onset of dementia, but it's a decline in verbal acuity, and it's severe compared to a decade ago. And again I have to wonder why you give Trump the benefit of the doubt on something so obvious to everyone except his cultists.
basil said:
I have to admit that I am a bit puzzled by the argument that he is recently showing early signs of dementia, but then use examples going back to 1984. If anything, that proves the opposite of what you are insinuating.
exactly. I scanned through that article and it reminded me of some of the reasons I didn't support Biden in the first place. But none of it suggests dementia. It's just a reminder than on many issues Joe Biden remains a relic of another era and his occasional weird pronouncements are more a reflection of his outmoded thinking than any recent decline.
ml1 said:
Smedley said:
Do you believe Biden in 2019/2020 debates, vs Biden vs Paul Ryan 2012, is not a dramatic and alarming decline?
no it's not alarming to me.
Certainly he's not as quick as when he was younger to find the words he wants to say, but who is? As I mentioned earlier, find me an unedited video of two or three minutes of Biden speaking and tell me it seems like a person with dementia. Aside from a fluffed word or two, what he says in its full context is perfectly reasonable.
otoh, Trump routinely rambles and repeats himself, jumping from clause to clause, often with no apparent logical connection. There is no comparison between his obvious impairment and Biden. It may not be the onset of dementia, but it's a decline in verbal acuity, and it's severe compared to a decade ago. And again I have to wonder why you give Trump the benefit of the doubt on something so obvious to everyone except his cultists.
Well we'll have to agree to disagree. Frankly I think you're off your own rocker with the vehemence and outright dismissal in your own arguments, ie. "no comparison", "something so obvious to everyone except his cultists", and previously stated "preposterous". I think you either have your head in the sand, and or more likely, you've fallen victim to the mental trap of believing what you want to believe.
Maybe Trump is just a mentally cognizant idiot.
"[Biden]'s going to do things that nobody ever would ever think even possible.
Because he’s following the radical left agenda. ...
No religion, no anything.
Hurt the Bible, hurt God.
He’s against God. He’s against guns.
He’s against energy, our kind of energy."
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