January 6-Rally for Democracy
January 6 is "Three Kings Day", commemorating when a ruler was told that he was going to be replaced, so he reacted by trying to prevent that by violence and death.
It’s also the day before the Orthodox churches’ Epiphany: the Blessing of the Waters ceremony. Hugely significant and deeply meaningful ceremony.
nohero said:
January 6 is "Three Kings Day", commemorating when a ruler was told that he was going to be replaced, so he reacted by trying to prevent that by violence and death.
I learn something new every day
Of course the idea of showing up with gifts a few days after the birth of a male child of the Hebrew faith always made me think it was the Bris.
STANV said:
Of course the idea of showing up with gifts a few days after the birth of a male child of the Hebrew faith always made me think it was the Bris.
that's Jan 1.
STANV said:
nohero said:
January 6 is "Three Kings Day", commemorating when a ruler was told that he was going to be replaced, so he reacted by trying to prevent that by violence and death.
I learn something new every day
There's more to it than that, I was just remarking on the part that has a modern counterpart.
STANV said:
Of course the idea of showing up with gifts a few days after the birth of a male child of the Hebrew faith always made me think it was the Bris.
The three kings were goyim.
nohero said:
The three kings were goyim.
Yes. They were goyim all the way to Bethlehem.
nohero said:
The three kings were goyim.
The words goy, and goyim, are rarely used as a compliment. And sometimes these words are used in a derogatory manner, or as a perjorative.
RealityForAll said:
The words goy, and goyim, are rarely used as a compliments. And sometimes these words are used as a derogatory perjorative.
I’m a gentile, and I’m not offended.
The three goyim wiseguys arrived late because there was no GPS back then, plus star configuration moves a bit from day to day.
Jaytee said:
RealityForAll said:
The words goy, and goyim, are rarely used as a compliments. And sometimes these words are used as a derogatory perjorative.
I’m a gentile, and I’m not offended.
The three goyim wiseguys arrived late because there was no GPS back then, plus star configuration moves a bit from day to day.
Do you really believe that the three kings were goyim?
If so, how did the three kings become goyim in light of the fact that Jesus took his first disciple, Andrew, many years after Jesus' birth. Which means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
RealityForAll said:
WHICH Means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
Zoroastrianism, on the other hand, had been, yonder in the East.
RealityForAll said:
Do you really believe that the three kings were goyim?
If so, how did the three kings become goyim in light of the fact that Jesus took his first disciple, Andrew, many years after Jesus' birth. WHICH Means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
I know they weren’t Christian…was everyone Jewish back in the days?
My Zoro friends, and several of my Greek Orthodox friends who were born in Egypt or Syria have reminded me regularly over the years that the Magi were indeed Zoroastrian, who were well-known for their astronomical skills.
i guess travelling via camel, mid-winter, from Persia to Bethlehem would take some time. We don’t really know when they left do we? Or what the incidental weather was like along the way? We just know they ‘followed the star’, which sounds backwards to me - but, hey, I live upside down to you 
ETA: besides, they had to collect their frankincense, sandalwood and myrrh along the way. So that’s a detour to at least Afghanistan or Pakistan, isn’t it? Or northern India? Somewhere along the Silk & Spice roads?
RealityForAll said:
Jaytee said:
RealityForAll said:
The words goy, and goyim, are rarely used as a compliments. And sometimes these words are used as a derogatory perjorative.
I’m a gentile, and I’m not offended.
The three goyim wiseguys arrived late because there was no GPS back then, plus star configuration moves a bit from day to day.Do you really believe that the three kings were goyim?
If so, how did the three kings become goyim in light of the fact that Jesus took his first disciple, Andrew, many years after Jesus' birth. Which means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
they could have been pagan, or as mtierney likes to call it, satanists.
RealityForAll said:
Do you really believe that the three kings were goyim?
If so, how did the three kings become goyim in light of the fact that Jesus took his first disciple, Andrew, many years after Jesus' birth. Which means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
The fact that they were not Jewish is kind of the point of the whole episode.
nohero said:
RealityForAll said:
Do you really believe that the three kings were goyim?
If so, how did the three kings become goyim in light of the fact that Jesus took his first disciple, Andrew, many years after Jesus' birth. Which means that the three kings were likely Jewish (as Christianity had not yet been established) at the time of Christ's birth.
The fact that they were not Jewish is kind of the point of the whole episode.
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
May I be silly for a second and reply that no-one could be ‘goyisch’ then because Yiddish hadn’t been invented?? However the rabbonim held many discussions over the decades and centuries prior re the non-Hebrews, non-Isrealites and non-Jews around them…
RealityForAll said:
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
RealityForAll said:
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
They were referred to as "magi" (Mt 2:1) - " Magi: originally a designation of the Persian priestly caste" (https://bible.usccb.org/bible/matthew/2#48002001-2)
They were not familiar with the Jewish scriptures, and so had to be assisted by Herod's chief priests and scribes (Mt 2:2-4)
They returned to their own country afterwards (Mt 2:12)
No, they weren't Jewish. And, as I said before, the fact that they weren't Jewish is the point of the episode.
RealityForAll said:
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
I have to admit I don't understand the point of this argument.
RealityForAll said:
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
Something tells me that you believe goyim is a term that refers only to Christians.
DaveSchmidt said:
Something tells me that you believe goyim is a term that refers only to Christians.
RealityForChristians
DaveSchmidt said:
RealityForAll said:
It appears most agree that the three kings (AKA three wise men) were literally NOT goyim when they traveled to Bethlehem for Jesus' birth. Why would you (nohero) call the three wise men goyim being that it was virtually impossible for them to be goyim at that point in time?
Something tells me that you believe goyim is a term that refers only to Christians.
That must be it. Occam's Razor.
STANV said:
There will be a rally at Spiotta Park on January 6 at 6:30PM. Please show your support.
Anyway, back to the matter at hand. I was told that the location may be moved over to by the train station, instead of at Spiotta Park.
nohero said:
Anyway, back to the matter at hand. I was told that the location may be moved over to by the train station, instead of at Spiotta Park.
Correct.
Please alert the Magi so they won't get lost or be late.
Briefly addressing the subjects of when the Birth was, which helps with how late the Magi arrived etc, I was browsing while sipping an early morning coffee (Good morning, everyone!). Stumbled up this enlightening mini-lecture - yes, it’s nearly 20 mins but very well put together, and explains not only history but also the intricacies of our modern dating conventions (years, not live matches!!), ancient politics and misunderstandings. Lovely clear charts.
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There will be a rally at Spiotta Park on January 6 at 6:30PM. Please show your support.