Is Pelosi really planning to visit Taiwan
Boy have times changed. I remember the last president got thrown under the bus repeatedly simply for taking a call from Taiwan's president.
Sounds like we are going to have a shooting war with China over Taiwan at some point in the not too distant future.
terp said:
Boy have times changed. I remember the last president got thrown under the bus repeatedly simply for taking a call from Taiwan's president.
What's changed? Pelosi is getting far more criticism than support for her trip.
drummerboy said:
terp said:
Boy have times changed. I remember the last president got thrown under the bus repeatedly simply for taking a call from Taiwan's president.
What's changed? Pelosi is getting far more criticism than support for her trip.
Not to mention that a President-to-President contact is in a different league from a Speaker of the House drop-in.
Also, the Chinese reaction at the time was this: "Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi said the call between Taiwan's president and Trump was 'just a small trick by Taiwan' that he believed would not change U.S. policy toward China, according to Hong Kong's Phoenix TV."
China's Foreign Minister: Trump-Taiwan Call 'A Small Trick' : NPR
Incredible footage of people cheering the arrival of @SpeakerPelosi’s jet in Taiwan earlier this evening. pic.twitter.com/d6qT66760K
— Samson Ellis (@samsonellis) August 2, 2022
tjohn said:
Hired by the CIA, I'm told by a reliable source. More American puppets.
There were probably cookies given out, also.
Taiwanese cheering Pelosi’s visit… while Americans are wringing their hands and getting anxiety attacks…
I’m with Nancy! Time to stand up to the bullies in this world.
Jaytee said:
Taiwanese cheering Pelosi’s visit… while Americans are wringing their hands and getting anxiety attacks…
I’m with Nancy! Time to stand up to the bullies in this world.
Taiwan is a product of the U.S. involving itself in a Chinese civil war. This situation is unlike that of Ukraine which earned its status as a recognized independent nation without our meddling. It was a byproduct of the USSR losing the Cold War.
I would expect the U.S., Taiwan and China to exhaust all possible measures to come up with a solution. Maybe we need to outlast Xi Jinping, but that will be a while. Even then, in the little bit of research I did on this, I think bringing Taiwan back under mainland control is something most Chinese believe in.
Again by contrast, while a lot of Russians think Ukraine should be brought back under Russian control, it seems like the majority were kind of okay with the status quo ante.
Kim Iversen weighs in on the Pelosi visit. It's really about signaling to corporations that the US Military has their backs. Pelosi is heavily invested in semiconductors, by the way.
It's a reckless trip, coming at a time when our economy is shaky and ordinary people have enough to deal with.
Newt Gingrich was the last Speaker of the House to go to Tawian in 1979 and he is thrilled that she is going. When we make Newt Gingrich happy, we should be sad. Trump also had that famous phone call from Taiwan (mentioned by terp) that viewed like a catastophe by Democrats back then but now they are applauding Pelosi who is doing worse.
Both parties are essentially the same when it comes to foreign policy--the crazy neocons rule the day.
It's a dangerous situation. We will have to see what the Chinese do, since they gave us lots of warnings. There will be some kind of hell to pay.
nan said:
Trump also had that famous phone call from Taiwan (mentioned by terp) that viewed like a catastophe by Democrats back then but now they are applauding Pelosi who is doing worse.
But I repeat myself.
nohero said:
drummerboy said:
terp said:
Boy have times changed. I remember the last president got thrown under the bus repeatedly simply for taking a call from Taiwan's president.
What's changed? Pelosi is getting far more criticism than support for her trip.
Not to mention that a President-to-President contact is in a different league from a Speaker of the House drop-in.
Also, the Chinese reaction at the time was this: "Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi said the call between Taiwan's president and Trump was 'just a small trick by Taiwan' that he believed would not change U.S. policy toward China, according to Hong Kong's Phoenix TV."
China's Foreign Minister: Trump-Taiwan Call 'A Small Trick' : NPR
nan said:
Kim Iversen weighs in on the Pelosi visit. It's really about signaling to corporations that the US Military has their backs. Pelosi is heavily invested in semiconductors, by the way.
Bernie voted against the bill to build up the U.S. semiconductor industry so that we were less dependent on Taiwan for the supply.
nan said:
Newt Gingrich was the last Speaker of the House to go to Tawian in 1979 and he is thrilled that she is going. When we make Newt Gingrich happy, we should be sad.
It was a toss-up between making Newt happy or Tom Friedman happy. Definitely a "no win" situation.
Opinion | Why Pelosi’s Visit to Taiwan Is Utterly Reckless - The New York Times (nytimes.com)
nan said:
Kim Iversen weighs in on the Pelosi visit. It's really about signaling to corporations that the US Military has their backs. Pelosi is heavily invested in semiconductors, by the way.
It's a reckless trip, coming at a time when our economy is shaky and ordinary people have enough to deal with.
Newt Gingrich was the last Speaker of the House to go to Tawian in 1979 and he is thrilled that she is going. When we make Newt Gingrich happy, we should be sad. Trump also had that famous phone call from Taiwan (mentioned by terp) that viewed like a catastophe by Democrats back then but now they are applauding Pelosi who is doing worse.
Both parties are essentially the same when it comes to foreign policy--the crazy neocons rule the day.
It's a dangerous situation. We will have to see what the Chinese do, since they gave us lots of warnings. There will be some kind of hell to pay.
Do you really think the Chinese leadership is so irrational that they would risk a war over a visit?
drummerboy said:
nan said:
Kim Iversen weighs in on the Pelosi visit. It's really about signaling to corporations that the US Military has their backs. Pelosi is heavily invested in semiconductors, by the way.
It's a reckless trip, coming at a time when our economy is shaky and ordinary people have enough to deal with.
Newt Gingrich was the last Speaker of the House to go to Tawian in 1979 and he is thrilled that she is going. When we make Newt Gingrich happy, we should be sad. Trump also had that famous phone call from Taiwan (mentioned by terp) that viewed like a catastophe by Democrats back then but now they are applauding Pelosi who is doing worse.
Both parties are essentially the same when it comes to foreign policy--the crazy neocons rule the day.
It's a dangerous situation. We will have to see what the Chinese do, since they gave us lots of warnings. There will be some kind of hell to pay.
Do you really think the Chinese leadership is so irrational that they would risk a war over a visit?
Yes. But we are the irrational ones.
nan said:
Yes. But we are the irrational ones.
speak for yourself…. Please
nan said:
Yes. But we are the irrational ones.
that sentence makes no sense
drummerboy said:
nan said:
Yes. But we are the irrational ones.
that sentence makes no sense
They made it clear they did not want us to come. And we did anyway. That's reckless and irrational. That's playing chicken with a nuclear power.
nan said:
drummerboy said:
nan said:
Yes. But we are the irrational ones.
that sentence makes no sense
They made it clear they did not want us to come. And we did anyway. That's reckless and irrational. That's playing chicken with a nuclear power.
You live in a very strange world where a visit by a politician risks nuclear war.
Very strange.
No one I know in Taiwan is concerned about an invasion or war over this or any visits. The only thing that would trigger something would be a declaration of independence by the government, which won't happen. All about maintaining face.
Time for some Michael Tracy.
Simultaneous knife-edge brinksmanship with multiple nuclear-armed powers: anyone's idea of a rational foreign policy
— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) August 2, 2022
More:
After months of lectures about the supposedly sacrosanct nature of "sovereignty" and "territorial integrity," those concepts are being thrown right back in the face of the US https://t.co/Pw7JRmoTJZ
— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) August 2, 2022
"China did not take the bait." They were not going to let the US provoke them.
They let Pelosi land and they condemned the visit and said there will be a military exercise on August 4. They will also put a plan together to accelerate the unification process.
China is responding methodically. So, there won't be a huge military reaction but there will be a strong, measured response.
They want to show to everyone in the world that the US is willing to break these agreements and that this gives the basis for China to accelerate the unification process. What many don't understand is that China has actually abided by the One China Policy and that China has an incredible amount of leverage as it grows, as it stabilizes, as it becomes a world leader in many different ways. China does not have to do what the United States does.
Lots more - interesting analysis.
Taiwan is paying the high price for Pelosi's visit.
nan said:
"China did not take the bait." They were not going to let the US provoke them.
They let Pelosi land and they condemned the visit and said there will be a military exercise on August 4. They will also put a plan together to accelerate the unification process.
China is responding methodically. So, there won't be a huge military reaction but there will be a strong, measured response.
They want to show to everyone in the world that the US is willing to break these agreements and that this gives the basis for China to accelerate the unification process. What many don't understand is that China has actually abided by the One China Policy and that China has an incredible amount of leverage as it grows, as it stabilizes, as it becomes a world leader in many different ways. China does not have to do what the United States does.
You certainly changed your tune. Weren't you talking about WW III before Pelosi went?
RTrent said:
You certainly changed your tune. Weren't you talking about WW III before Pelosi went?
Yeah, but now China has turned into the big responsible world leader who won't be baited by the evil U.S.
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