Hearty Congratulations to Julian Assange For Completing 1,000 Days In His Putrid Cell
Remember when he was convicted by a jury of his peers? That was awesome!
Even if he was convicted, should we be endorsing torture?
Julian Assange Is Suffering Psychological Torture, U.N. Expert Says
terp said:
Remember when he was convicted by a jury of his peers? That was awesome!
Who's been against putting him on trial, other than him and his supporters?
terp said:
Remember when he was convicted by a jury of his peers? That was awesome!
Was that before or after the convictions of the prisoners at Guantanamo?
nohero said:
terp said:
Remember when he was convicted by a jury of his peers? That was awesome!
Who's been against putting him on trial, other than him and his supporters?
Exactly. Not sure why this truth telling savior is so afraid of standing trial in the US. He should embrace a trial. It would get him out of that nice cell and if he loses the case here, he may even get a bigger cell! It's a win-win for him.
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
mtierney said:
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
No need to review. We know Liz voted to impeach your Lord and Savior.
mtierney said:
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
Here's me, in 2016:
"I'll note that repulsive as Bush and Cheney's actions have been, I would vote for them in a heartbeat over Trump. Trump is that dangerous to the country"
I think that's held up well.
PVW said:
mtierney said:
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
Here's me, in 2016:
"I'll note that repulsive as Bush and Cheney's actions have been, I would vote for them in a heartbeat over Trump. Trump is that dangerous to the country"
I think that's held up well.
To have this opinion, you need to be ok with wanton murder of poor people. Its sociopathic.
sbenois said:
nohero said:
terp said:
Remember when he was convicted by a jury of his peers? That was awesome!
Who's been against putting him on trial, other than him and his supporters?
Exactly. Not sure why this truth telling savior is so afraid of standing trial in the US. He should embrace a trial. It would get him out of that nice cell and if he loses the case here, he may even get a bigger cell! It's a win-win for him.
If and when he's extradited, I hope he fairs better than Epstien while awaiting his show trial.
terp said:
PVW said:
mtierney said:
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
Here's me, in 2016:
"I'll note that repulsive as Bush and Cheney's actions have been, I would vote for them in a heartbeat over Trump. Trump is that dangerous to the country"
I think that's held up well.
To have this opinion, you need to be ok with wanton murder of poor people. Its sociopathic.
you've never understood Trump's danger.
drummerboy said:
terp said:
PVW said:
mtierney said:
The Assange story has been in and out of the news for so long, that a tutorial is required reading. “Hardass” Cheney — and, IMHO, his daughter — need reviewing.
Here's me, in 2016:
"I'll note that repulsive as Bush and Cheney's actions have been, I would vote for them in a heartbeat over Trump. Trump is that dangerous to the country"
I think that's held up well.
To have this opinion, you need to be ok with wanton murder of poor people. Its sociopathic.
you've never understood Trump's danger.
Explain it to me like I'm 3 years old.
terp said:
Explain it to me like I'm 3 years old.
seriously, if you haven't figured it out in 6 years, there's no hope.
drummerboy said:
terp said:
Explain it to me like I'm 3 years old.
seriously, if you haven't figured it out in 6 years, there's no hope.
If you're not willing to explain then don't complain that I don't understand your fears which until explained will come across as irrational.
drummerboy said:
you've never understood Trump's danger.
maybe it’s because he’s more of a DeSantis disciple. Trumpenstein is lame in comparison. If DeSantis runs in 2024, trumpenstein will self combust. We ain’t seen nuttin yet.
terp said:
To have this opinion, you need to be ok with wanton murder of poor people. Its sociopathic.
The Bush administration was a colossal moral, political, and strategic disaster. I'm clearly making a provocative statement by comparing Bush and Cheney favorably to Trump and, while I don't really get your comment, I'll take it as meaning "please explain that, because Bush and Cheney were really bad."
If Trump had been president from 2000 - 2008, do I think he would have acted better? No, I don't. When 9/11 happened, I believe that if anything he would have been less restrained than Bush. Given Trump's nature and imagining him at the helm in 2001, I can easily imagine worse outcomes than the actual terrible choices Bush and Cheney made.
What about projecting the other way, if Bush or Cheney were president in 2016 - 20? There was plenty of drone and missile strikes and bombings under Trump, so he wasn't exactly Mr. Peace and Love in foreign policy. I was worried about there being a full on war with Iran. Hard to say how that would have shaken out if Bush or Cheney were president. I think it's mostly luck that Trump didn't get us into a war there, but his actions have made a future war more likely (and should he return to office, I don't trust that luck to hold out). Certainly Bush or Cheney would have handled the pandemic better, and so tens of thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands, people would still be alive who are not.
Trump is far crueler than either Bush or Cheney. Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo are deep stains, but kidnapping children as as a matter of policy.... that's a whole lower level.
The biggest problem with Trump, though, is that he threatens to undermine democratic government, and has had an alarming amount of success. It's not controversial on this thread to call the Bush administration "a moral disaster," but millions of Americans disagree. Or, to take another example, libertarian philosophy to me is little more than a justification for a sort of neo-feudalism where the wealthy lord it over the rest of us, whereas for others it's the only exit off the road to serfdom. How can we possibly reconcile such widely divergent views?
The best way such differences can be settled is that citizens must try to convince each other of their views and, if successful, attempt to put those view into practice and be accountable for the results. Trumpism ends that. If a losing candidate can simply refuse to leave -- summoning a violent mob to back him up necessary -- then we lose the ability to change our mind as a country. Where does this lead other than increasing violence at home and abroad? For all of Bush and Cheney's many sins, I do not believe they would have mounted a campaign to end democracy if Kerry had won in 2004. With Trump, we now have one of our major parties increasingly explicitly opposed to self government. Serious and terrible as the Iraq invasion was, I think Trumpism's threat and long-term effects will prove deeper and longer lasting.
PVW,
Not sure a three-year old would understand your explanation but it should suffice for anyone with a high school education.
terp said:
Explain it to me like I'm 3 years old.
He had small children separated from their parents causing long-term trauma to them.
His denialist response to COVID led to thousands of preventable deaths.
When a group of black teenagers who had been confined to prison as a result of coerced confessions were found to have been innocent and granted compensation Trump criticized the decision. To me that was evidence of racism. His birtherism and and his announcement speech declaring Mexicans to be rapists were also evidence of racism. To me a principal lesson of the 20th Century is that racism leads to genocide.
I do not expect you to agree but that's my simple explanation.
terp said:
If and when he's extradited, I hope he fairs better than Epstien while awaiting his show trial.
Apparently you do not accept that Epstein committed suicide, but I do not understand your reference to "show trial". Please explain it to me like I am three years old.
STANV said:
Apparently you do not accept that Epstein committed suicide, but I do not understand your reference to "show trial". Please explain it to me like I am three years old.
I assume he believes that Epstein, a man who could afford the best justice money can buy, wasn't going to get a fair trial.
tjohn said:
I assume he believes that Epstein, a man who could afford the best justice money can buy, wasn't going to get a fair trial.
Apparently Epstein believed that as well which may be why he committed suicide.
On Epstein, as I noted when we were discussing it, the real scandal is that people die and are seriously abused in our prisons every day, but few find this scandalous or shocking. Let one rich white man die, though, and suddenly everyone cares. But do they take this as an opportunity to improve our prisons? No -- it just becomes fodder for conspiracy theories. The "wrong" kind of person got caught up in our system, but we don't actually want to fix the system, so we find yet another way to look away.
STANV said:
Apparently Epstein believed that as well which may be why he committed suicide.
Or he knew his goose was cooked fair and square and couldn't deal with it.
I don't think people actually care that Epstein died in prison. I think they care that a good deal of the truth died with Epstein.
tjohn said:
I don't think people actually care that Epstein died in prison. I think they care that a good deal of the truth died with Epstein.
exactly. And that's the fodder for conspiracies. Just like the truth dying with Oswald.
Look at all the Qanon people awaiting JFK Jr to drive into town any minute. Are any of them still there? What have been their explanations for why he didn't arrive?
jamie said:
Look at all the Qanon people awaiting JFK Jr to drive into town any minute. Are any of them still there? What have been their explanations for why he didn't arrive?
Maybe his GPS didn't work. Don't you hate it when that happens?
jamie said:
Look at all the Qanon people awaiting JFK Jr to drive into town any minute. Are any of them still there? What have been their explanations for why he didn't arrive?
That Junior, he's always getting lost.
Only quite a few thousand to go. Best of luck to him!