Getting My Rona Vaccine. Essex County

bikefixed said:

I wasn't interested in piling on a concerned person. He said good stuff in his post after those first couple of sentences, but go right ahead and dispense with everything else there. Thankey.

 Yeah, but that opening was a helluva thing.

bub said:

And have we already gotten so jaded about the performance of these 2 vaccines that we are using the word "only" to describe a 95% effectiveness rate?

I believe "only" was meant to go with "symptoms," not the percentage: The vaccine stops only symptoms, not the virus.

That's just my grammatical diagnosis. I trust the other kind to bikefixed.

Howdy,

I was just listening to a discussion about the new COVID variant, B.1.1.7 or VUI-202012/01, on NPR this morning and I wondered about how it has managed to substantially raise its Rt number without being more directly harmful to the person it infects - at least from what they see so far.

One theory supposed was that the virus is able to make more of itself quicker and thus there'd be more of it hanging out in the nasal and oral mucosa to eject when one breathes, sneezes, coughs, speaks, sings & whatever. I'm not in agreement with that one though, because they have consistently found that the severity of cases follows the viral load and this higher viral replication theory seems like it would also bring a faster and more furious onset of symptoms. I dunno, but if its tendency to cause serious harm is similar to the one(s) we've come to know and loathe since last winter, things could get rough again. Check out the graph halfway down this article about Britain's situation.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-eight-year-old-dies-with-coronavirus-as-cases-exceed-50-000-for-fourth-day-running-12176904

Or maybe it is stickier so the odds of it grabbing and holding on are higher. You wouldn't need as high a concentration of virus particles to achieve transmission in a given space. I don't think a mutation could enable a virus to more easily penetrate a mask but it could be possible. What do I know? One thing that could bode well for us though would be the possibility that a person contracts COVID only with a lower viral load. Maybe that's fine for folks without pre-existing conditions that make them more susceptible but it is worrisome for those who have such risk factors.

When I interview contacts I ask about things such as current/former smoking, any pulmonary issues like asthma (and possibly allergic irritations), overweight (but like a BMI of 40 or more), DM I or II, hypertension, any autoimmune issue, recreational substance use (but nothing specified on the survey), any liver or kidney conditions. There are a few more unspecified general things on the list to ask about but you get what I'm saying. This COVID variant is now able to cast a wider net amongst people who are dealing with such conditions, knowingly or not. People with poor access to health care as it was before this pandemic are that much more at risk.

Wear masks please.

Here is CDC press release about effectiveness of the influenza vaccine last winter.  50% effectiveness at best. 

https://www.aafp.org/news/health-of-the-public/20200226interimfluve.html#:~:text=21%20CDC%20Morbidity%20and%20Mortality,influenza%20A(H1N1)pdm09.

95% effectiveness for the Coronavirus vaccine is very high.

yahooyahoo said:

Here is CDC press release about effectiveness of the influenza vaccine last winter.  50% effectiveness at best. 

https://www.aafp.org/news/health-of-the-public/20200226interimfluve.html#:~:text=21%20CDC%20Morbidity%20and%20Mortality,influenza%20A(H1N1)pdm09.

95% effectiveness for the Coronavirus vaccine is very high.

 I think the difference is that flu vac is a guesswork on which variation of the annual flu will appear each year. The C-19 vac was made for a specific target. 

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

yahooyahoo said:

Here is CDC press release about effectiveness of the influenza vaccine last winter.  50% effectiveness at best. 

https://www.aafp.org/news/health-of-the-public/20200226interimfluve.html#:~:text=21%20CDC%20Morbidity%20and%20Mortality,influenza%20A(H1N1)pdm09.

95% effectiveness for the Coronavirus vaccine is very high.

 I think the difference is that flu vac is a guesswork on which variation of the annual flu will appear each year. The C-19 vac was made for a specific target. 

 Likely true, but 95% is a very high effectiveness even for a vaccine with a specific target.

Formerlyjerseyjack said:

yahooyahoo said:

Here is CDC press release about effectiveness of the influenza vaccine last winter.  50% effectiveness at best. 

https://www.aafp.org/news/health-of-the-public/20200226interimfluve.html#:~:text=21%20CDC%20Morbidity%20and%20Mortality,influenza%20A(H1N1)pdm09.

95% effectiveness for the Coronavirus vaccine is very high.

 I think the difference is that flu vac is a guesswork on which variation of the annual flu will appear each year. The C-19 vac was made for a specific target. 

 Yeah, the yearly influenza 'cover your eyes, throw that dart and hope you hit the target' jamboree is one of the facts of our lives. Okay, it isn't really like that but you get my drift [sorry, epidemiology pun]. There are many candidate virus targets to choose from each year when they mix the vaccine cocktail.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/vaccine-selection.htm

sac said:

 Likely true, but 95% is a very high effectiveness even for a vaccine with a specific target.

Its a double shot. A single shot is much less effective.

What would the effectiveness of the flu vaccines be if they were given as a double?

Floyd said:

sac said:

 Likely true, but 95% is a very high effectiveness even for a vaccine with a specific target.

Its a double shot. A single shot is much less effective.

What would the effectiveness of the flu vaccines be if they were given as a double?

 Wouldn't matter very much, if at all. The problem with the flu vaccine is that it can only target one of the many flu strains that might be out there in a given flu season. So it could theoretically be 100% effective against strain A, but if a lot of people end up getting infected with strain B, C or D, then the overall effectiveness drops proportionally.

That's my understanding anyway.

Which raises the question of why can't we get multiple flu shots each year to cover different strains?

bikefixed?

I recall a few years ago a particularly bad flu season and they said afterwards the year before’s shots had been less than 20 percent effective, and they were worried that would cause people not to bother with them going forward, because getting one is basically a shot in the dark. (No pun intended. I just can’t think of another phrase...)

A somewhat simplified answer, there are the four main strains of flu, A,B, C, and D.  Then there are the sub strains, H1N1, H5N9, etc.  There are 18 potential H strains and 11 potential N strains, making it almost impossible to predict and make a vaccine that will be 95% effective.  However, if you have the vaccine and catch the flu because the strain was different, you are less likely to get a serious version of the disease, so it is still worth getting the flu shot every fall.

For whatever reason(s), the flu numbers are way down this year.  

bub said:

For whatever reason(s), the flu numbers are way down this year.  

 Everyone is staying home.  When people need to go out they're wearing a mask.

spontaneous said:

bub said:

For whatever reason(s), the flu numbers are way down this year.  

 Everyone is staying home.  When people need to go out they're wearing a mask.

 I have to say, wearing a mask in flu season when in crowded locations might become a habit I keep. I'd see people in the city wearing masks sometimes (usually Asian), and always thought it looked a bit silly, but my attitude's changed on that. Turns out people from places that have experienced pandemic respiratory illnesses might know a thing or two.

PVW said:

spontaneous said:

bub said:

For whatever reason(s), the flu numbers are way down this year.  

 Everyone is staying home.  When people need to go out they're wearing a mask.

 I have to say, wearing a mask in flu season when in crowded locations might become a habit I keep. I'd see people in the city wearing masks sometimes (usually Asian), and always thought it looked a bit silly, but my attitude's changed on that. Turns out people from places that have experienced pandemic respiratory illnesses might know a thing or two.

Also, people have become much more diligent about washing their hands, or using hand sanitizer, and not touching their face.  

It has to be some combination of masks/distancing, more people getting the flu vaccine this year, and perhaps the effectiveness of this year's vaccine.  This is a huge relief as you recall the dire fears of a double punch of a bad winter flu season and a Covid surge.  The latter alone has been bad enough.  

bub said:

It has to be some combination of masks/distancing, more people getting the flu vaccine this year, and perhaps the effectiveness of this year's vaccine.  This is a huge relief as you recall the dire fears of a double punch of a bad winter flu season and a Covid surge.  The latter alone has been bad enough.  

One additional possibility: Covid has winnowed the flu’s normal target population.

Are there any reported cases of people showing up at hospitals infected with both covid and flu?

Here is a NJ Department of Health site that allows you to pre-register for a COVID-19 vaccination. You will not get a date right away, but you will be in the system and the confirmation letter you receive will let you know which phase you are in:
https://covid19.nj.gov/pages/vaccine?fbclid=IwAR12FuasQxNFp7uafp2JWs9pv9WbE2UOUS85btn0AS5U70QV4TXvtYY4WYI

"New Jersey has been slower than other states to administer coronavirus vaccines, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.

Only twelve other states have vaccinated fewer people per capita than New Jersey, the data shows.

New Jersey vaccinated 1.14% of its population with 101,000 doses administered as of Jan. 4, lagging behind neighboring states on a percentage basis, the data showed. Connecticut vaccinated 2.13% of its population with 76,000 doses, followed by New York at 1.54% or 300,000 doses, and Pennsylvania at 1.27% or 163,000 doses."

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2021/01/nj-covid-19-vaccine-states-rates-are-lower-than-neighboring-states-report-says.html

Today’s text.   Jan. 5th.. telling me to show up for my shot on Dec. 30th.

Give them time to clean up the early misses on the system.   It has gotten much better.

My wife was able to sign up on the new state pre-registration site that popped up

Good.

That CDC link I posted does a decent job of describing the difficulties faced when trying to come up with an effective anticipatory seasonal flu vaccine each year. I don't know much about the decision-making process and can only speculate on why we don't have multiple vaccine shots each year. Expense? Public resistance?

My husband and I both received the vaccine at the Sears building today. We were incredibly impressed with the efficiency of the entire operation. We were in and out within 30 minutes and that included the 15 minutes after the injection where you sit to make sure you don’t have a reaction. Well done Essex County!

President-elect Biden announced today that he will release most of the available vaccines to speed delivery to more people, rather than holding back one-half to assure that people get the second dose, which was the Trump administration's approach. 

https://federalnewsnetwork.com/government-news/2021/01/biden-to-speed-release-of-coronavirus-vaccines/

Is there going to be an official policy of delaying the 2nd shot?  Interesting because Fauci came out firmly against that.

What I heard is Biden wants to push all the shots out so more people at least get the first shot ASAP.

bub said:

Is there going to be an official policy of delaying the 2nd shot?  Interesting because Fauci came out firmly against that.

"A transition official said the Biden team believes that vaccine manufacturers will be able to produce enough second doses in a timely fashion while administering first doses to more Americans. Biden's team plans to use the Defense Production Act to produce vaccine materials and other supplies in order to ensure there's enough vaccine for both doses."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/08/politics/biden-vaccine-strategy/index.html